John Samy trying to hijack the name "Fijian" again - FijiBoardExiles - Fiji - FijiBoardExiles - Message Board

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Posts: 921

08/05/08 03:53:06

Ratu

Just a small correction, I don't think Red Indian is PC anymore I think it is an American Indian. Afterall they aren't red and originated out of Asia. All this name calling is a rather bizarre philosophical concept. If we were to take it on American standards then it would be Fijian African and Fijian Indian. Would the recent people from Fiji who have migrated to the US then be American Fijians and further defined to American Fijian Indians but NOT American Indians because they use to be the Red ones? I am sooo confused. You gotta love it, especially if we all supposedly originated out of Africa, then would I be an African, European, Hawaiian American???Fijian??? because I now live here? Or do we base it on Home is where the heart is? Or where we presently live, or where our parents were born, or where we were born or where we were raised. I am still confused.
We could simplify it and say we all came from Earth but then there are other theories where the earth was seeded by aliens and hence the reason for the evolutionary explosion. But then we couldn't call them aliens because we are of the same root, but then again we don't know where "they" came from. But we do know that one way or the other we all come from the same root and share the same genetic code.
Perhaps we could define it by lifestyle choices, ie this person enjoys a culturally Fijian or American or Indian etc life style no matter what their appearance may indicate they should be. Then we get into... Well the name is already taken, does that mean anyone with the name of George, Bob, Jennifer or Barbara has to give it up because it is already taken.
OR does it all come down to compartmentalizing the whole human race so we can create divisions, then we can hate a whole and entire group of people rather than the few people of that group who have wronged us or that we don't understand. Now that we have these wonderful compartments, we can even go to war over it, and have coups, commit genocide and all kinds of fun things.
OR do we lift the passage out of Shakesphere that a rose is a rose by any other name and a human is a human by any other name and leave it at that because at the end of the day we are all sharing one planet at the moment.
We as humans are supposed to the intelligent ones yet I have never met a Dog who decided he didn't like another dog because he was a collie and this one was a mongrel or a German Shephard or an English Spaniel, American Bloodhound, German shephard, Scottish Terries or an Irish Setter. Don't you love the fact that as humans we have even given dogs territorial compartments by stating their country of origin. The real irony if you were to put most humans under the same scrunity we do for dogs, most of us would be mongrels and the dogs could care less if they are an Austrailian heeler or a mongrel. The poor dumb animals, don't have a clue about what they are missing by having a compartment. My goodness the amount of dog fights they are missing out on is astonishing.
Well that was a fun little bit of free association and the only answer I really like is the Dogs point of view.

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gdevreal

It is not really complicated

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Posts: 494

08/05/08 07:52:19

If people have a name, you don't try to force them to change it, and you don't try to steal it or adulterate it. Of course some people cannot understand this because they come from a caste system which does not recognize any rights for people they perceive to be beneath them.

By the way, the word "gay" is also a stolen word, but at least it was not someone's name getting stolen. Oops! I knew a girl in primary school named Gay. I wonder whether she has been forced to change her name or she still introduces herself: "Hello, I am Gay". You see the problem?

I doubt anyone has a problem with a "common name", and as of now, it stands as "Fiji Citizen", which I have not heard any objection to. Trying to use the word Fijian is a deliberate and insensitive attempt to marginalize and insult a whole ethnicity of People. In short, it is a thinly disguised Racist move.

So John Samy pushes for an innocent sounding concept "Common Name" for all Citizens of Fiji, but then tries to sneak in the back door a partial theft of identity. It is totally unnecessary. If he does not like "Fiji Citizen", perhaps he can pick a name no other race would feel insulted by like Kulina.

Last Edited By: gdevreal 08/05/08 10:47:09. Edited 1 time.

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gdevreal

UN Declaraton Section 14

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Posts: 496

08/05/08 11:00:31

Article 14

Indigenous peoples have the right to revitalize, use, develop and transmit to future generations their histories, languages, oral traditions, philosophies, writing systems and literatures, and to designate and retain their own names for communities, places and persons.

Or if you want to enlighten yourself, read the whole thing. The current Junta and Racist IG has violated this convention in so many ways.

1994/45. Draft United Nations declaration on the rights of
indigenous peoples

The Sub-Commission on Prevention of Discrimination and Protection of Minorities,

Recalling its resolutions 1985/22 of 29 August 1985, 1991/30 of 29 August 1991, 1992/33 of 27 August 1992, 1993/46 of 26 August 1993,

Taking into account, in particular, paragraph 3 of its resolution 1993/46, in which it decided to postpone until its forty-sixth session consideration of the draft United Nations declaration on the rights of indigenous peoples agreed upon by the members of the Working Group on Indigenous Populations, to request the Secretary-General to submit the draft declaration to the appropriate services in the Centre for Human Rights for its technical revision, and to submit, if possible, the draft declaration to the Commission on Human Rights with the recommendation that the Commission adopt it at its fifty-first session,

Recalling Commission on Human Rights resolution 1994/29 of 4 March 1994, in which the Sub-Commission was urged to complete its consideration of the draft United Nations declaration at its forty-sixth session and to submit it to the Commission at its fifty-first session together with any recommendations thereon,

Bearing in mind General Assembly resolution 47/75 of 14 December 1992, paragraph 12 of Commission on Human Rights resolution 1993/30 of 5 March 1993, paragraph 6 (a) of Commission resolution 1993/31 of 5 March 1993 and paragraph II.28 of the Vienna Declaration and Programme of Action (A/Conf.157/23),

Having considered the report of the Working Group on Indigenous Populations on its twelfth session (E/CN.4/Sub.2/1994/30 and Corr.1), in particular the general comments on the draft declaration and the recommendations contained in chapters II and IX respectively of the report,

Taking into account the technical review of the draft declaration prepared by the Centre for Human Rights (E/CN.4/Sub.2/1994/2 and Add.1),

1. Expresses its satisfaction at the conclusion of the deliberations on the draft United Nations declaration on the rights of indigenous peoples by the Working Group on Indigenous Populations and the general views of the participants as reflected in the report of the Working Group on its twelfth session;

2. Expresses its appreciation to the Chairperson-Rapporteur of the Working Group, Ms. Erica-Irene Daes, and to the present and former members of the Working Group for their contributions to the process of elaboration of the draft declaration;

3. Expresses its appreciation to the Centre for Human Rights for its technical revision of the draft declaration;

4. Decides:

(a) To adopt the draft United Nations declaration on the rights of indigenous peoples agreed upon by members of the Working Group as contained in the annex to the present resolution;

(b) To submit the draft declaration to the Commission on Human Rights at its fifty-first session with the request that it consider the draft as expeditiously as possible;

(c) To request the Secretary-General to transmit the text of the draft declaration to indigenous peoples and organizations, Governments and intergovernmental organizations and to include in the note of transmittal the information that the draft declaration is to be submitted to the Commission on Human Rights at its fifty-first session;

5. Recommends that the Commission on Human Rights and the Economic and Social Council take effective measures to ensure that representatives of indigenous peoples are able to participate in the consideration of the draft declaration by these two bodies, regardless of their consultative status with the Economic and Social Council.

36th meeting
26 August 1994

[Adopted without a vote. See chap. XVI. E/CN.4/Sub.2/1994/56]

Annex

DRAFT UNITED NATIONS DECLARATION ON THE RIGHTS
OF INDIGENOUS PEOPLES

Affirming that indigenous peoples are equal in dignity and rights to all other peoples, while recognizing the right of all peoples to be different, to consider themselves different, and to be respected as such,

Affirming also that all peoples contribute to the diversity and richness of civilizations and cultures, which constitute the common heritage of humankind,

Affirming further that all doctrines, policies and practices based on or advocating superiority of peoples or individuals on the basis of national origin, racial, religious, ethnic or cultural differences are racist, scientifically false, legally invalid, morally condemnable and socially unjust,

Reaffirming also that indigenous peoples, in the exercise of their rights, should be free from discrimination of any kind,

Concerned that indigenous peoples have been deprived of their human rights and fundamental freedoms, resulting, inter alia, in their colonization and dispossession of their lands, territories and resources, thus preventing them from exercising, in particular, their right to development in accordance with their own needs and interests,

Recognizing the urgent need to respect and promote the inherent rights and characteristics of indigenous peoples, especially their rights to their lands, territories and resources, which derive from their political, economic and social structures and from their cultures, spiritual traditions, histories and philosophies,

Welcoming the fact that indigenous peoples are organizing themselves for political, economic, social and cultural enhancement and in order to bring an end to all forms of discrimination and oppression wherever they occur,

Convinced that control by indigenous peoples over developments affecting them and their lands, territories and resources will enable them to maintain and strengthen their institutions, cultures and traditions, and to promote their development in accordance with their aspirations and needs,

Recognizing also that respect for indigenous knowledge, cultures and traditional practices contributes to sustainable and equitable development and proper management of the environment,

Emphasizing the need for demilitarization of the lands and territories of indigenous peoples, which will contribute to peace, economic and social progress and development, understanding and friendly relations among nations and peoples of the world,

Recognizing in particular the right of indigenous families and communities to retain shared responsibility for the upbringing, training, education and well-being of their children,

Recognizing also that indigenous peoples have the right freely to determine their relationships with States in a spirit of coexistence, mutual benefit and full respect,

Considering that treaties, agreements and other arrangements between States and indigenous peoples are properly matters of international concern and responsibility,

Acknowledging that the Charter of the United Nations, the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights affirm the fundamental importance of the right of self-determination of all peoples, by virtue of which they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development,

Bearing in mind that nothing in this Declaration may be used to deny any peoples their right of self-determination,

Encouraging States to comply with and effectively implement all international instruments, in particular those related to human rights, as they apply to indigenous peoples, in consultation and cooperation with the peoples concerned,

Emphasizing that the United Nations has an important and continuing role to play in promoting and protecting the rights of indigenous peoples,

Believing that this Declaration is a further important step forward for the recognition, promotion and protection of the rights and freedoms of indigenous peoples and in the development of relevant activities of the United Nations system in this field,

Solemnly proclaims the following United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples:

PART I

Article 1

Indigenous peoples have the right to the full and effective enjoyment of all human rights and fundamental freedoms recognized in the Charter of the United Nations, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and international human rights law.

Article 2

Indigenous individuals and peoples are free and equal to all other individuals and peoples in dignity and rights, and have the right to be free from any kind of adverse discrimination, in particular that based on their indigenous origin or identity.

Article 3

Indigenous peoples have the right of self-determination. By virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development.

Article 4

Indigenous peoples have the right to maintain and strengthen their distinct political, economic, social and cultural characteristics, as well as their legal systems, while retaining their rights to participate fully, if they so choose, in the political, economic, social and cultural life of the State.

Article 5

Every indigenous individual has the right to a nationality.

PART II

Article 6

Indigenous peoples have the collective right to live in freedom, peace and security as distinct peoples and to full guarantees against genocide or any other act of violence, including the removal of indigenous children from their families and communities under any pretext.

In addition, they have the individual rights to life, physical and mental integrity, liberty and security of person.

Article 7

Indigenous peoples have the collective and individual right not to be subjected to ethnocide and cultural genocide, including prevention of and redress for:

(a) Any action which has the aim or effect of depriving them of their integrity as distinct peoples, or of their cultural values or ethnic identities;

(b) Any action which has the aim or effect of dispossessing them of their lands, territories or resources;

(d) Any form of assimilation or integration by other cultures or ways of life imposed on them by legislative, administrative or other measures;

(e) Any form of propaganda directed against them.

Article 8

Indigenous peoples have the collective and individual right to maintain and develop their distinct identities and characteristics, including the right to identify themselves as indigenous and to be recognized as such.

Article 9

Indigenous peoples and individuals have the right to belong to an indigenous community or nation, in accordance with the traditions and customs of the community or nation concerned. No disadvantage of any kind may arise from the exercise of such a right.

Article 10

Indigenous peoples shall not be forcibly removed from their lands or territories. No relocation shall take place without the free and informed consent of the indigenous peoples concerned and after agreement on just and fair compensation and, where possible, with the option of return.

Article 11

Indigenous peoples have the right to special protection and security in periods of armed conflict.

States shall observe international standards, in particular the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949, for the protection of civilian populations in circumstances of emergency and armed conflict, and shall not:

(a) Recruit indigenous individuals against their will into the armed forces and, in particular, for use against other indigenous peoples;

(b) Recruit indigenous children into the armed forces under any circumstances;

(c) Force indigenous individuals to abandon their lands, territories or means of subsistence, or relocate them in special centres for military purposes;

(d) Force indigenous individuals to work for military purposes under any discriminatory conditions.

PART III

Article 12

Indigenous peoples have the right to practise and revitalize their cultural traditions and customs. This includes the right to maintain, protect and develop the past, present and future manifestations of their cultures, such as archaeological and historical sites, artifacts, designs, ceremonies, technologies and visual and performing arts and literature, as well as the right to the restitution of cultural, intellectual, religious and spiritual property taken without their free and informed consent or in violation of their laws, traditions and customs.

Article 13

Indigenous peoples have the right to manifest, practise, develop and teach their spiritual and religious traditions, customs and ceremonies; the right to maintain, protect, and have access in privacy to their religious and cultural sites; the right to the use and control of ceremonial objects; and the right to the repatriation of human remains.

States shall take effective measures, in conjunction with the indigenous peoples concerned, to ensure that indigenous sacred places, including burial sites, be preserved, respected and protected.

Article 14

States shall take effective measures, whenever any right of indigenous peoples may be threatened, to ensure this right is protected and also to ensure that they can understand and be understood in political, legal and administrative proceedings, where necessary through the provision of interpretation or by other appropriate means.

PART IV

Article 15

Indigenous children have the right to all levels and forms of education of the State. All indigenous peoples also have this right and the right to establish and control their educational systems and institutions providing education in their own languages, in a manner appropriate to their cultural methods of teaching and learning.

Indigenous children living outside their communities have the right to be provided access to education in their own culture and language.

States shall take effective measures to provide appropriate resources for these purposes.

Article 16

Indigenous peoples have the right to have the dignity and diversity of their cultures, traditions, histories and aspirations appropriately reflected in all forms of education and public information.

States shall take effective measures, in consultation with the indigenous peoples concerned, to eliminate prejudice and discrimination and to promote tolerance, understanding and good relations among indigenous peoples and all segments of society.

Article 17

Indigenous peoples have the right to establish their own media in their own languages. They also have the right to equal access to all forms of non-indigenous media.

States shall take effective measures to ensure that State-owned media duly reflect indigenous cultural diversity.

Article 18

Indigenous peoples have the right to enjoy fully all rights established under international labour law and national labour legislation.

Indigenous individuals have the right not to be subjected to any discriminatory conditions of labour, employment or salary.

PART V

Article 19

Indigenous peoples have the right to participate fully, if they so choose, at all levels of decision-making in matters which may affect their rights, lives and destinies through representatives chosen by themselves in accordance with their own procedures, as well as to maintain and develop their own indigenous decision-making institutions.

Article 20

Indigenous peoples have the right to participate fully, if they so choose, through procedures determined by them, in devising legislative or administrative measures that may affect them.

States shall obtain the free and informed consent of the peoples concerned before adopting and implementing such measures.

Article 21

Indigenous peoples have the right to maintain and develop their political, economic and social systems, to be secure in the enjoyment of their own means of subsistence and development, and to engage freely in all their traditional and other economic activities. Indigenous peoples who have been deprived of their means of subsistence and development are entitled to just and fair compensation.

Article 22

Indigenous peoples have the right to special measures for the immediate, effective and continuing improvement of their economic and social conditions, including in the areas of employment, vocational training and retraining, housing, sanitation, health and social security.

Particular attention shall be paid to the rights and special needs of indigenous elders, women, youth, children and disabled persons.

Article 23

Indigenous peoples have the right to determine and develop priorities and strategies for exercising their right to development. In particular, indigenous peoples have the right to determine and develop all health, housing and other economic and social programmes affecting them and, as far as possible, to administer such programmes through their own institutions.

Article 24

Indigenous peoples have the right to their traditional medicines and health practices, including the right to the protection of vital medicinal plants, animals and minerals.

They also have the right to access, without any discrimination, to all medical institutions, health services and medical care.

PART VI

Article 25

Indigenous peoples have the right to maintain and strengthen their distinctive spiritual and material relationship with the lands, territories, waters and coastal seas and other resources which they have traditionally owned or otherwise occupied or used, and to uphold their responsibilities to future generations in this regard.

Article 26

Indigenous peoples have the right to own, develop, control and use the lands and territories, including the total environment of the lands, air, waters, coastal seas, sea-ice, flora and fauna and other resources which they have traditionally owned or otherwise occupied or used. This includes the right to the full recognition of their laws, traditions and customs, land-tenure systems and institutions for the development and management of resources, and the right to effective measures by States to prevent any interference with, alienation of or encroachment upon these rights.

Article 27

Indigenous peoples have the right to the restitution of the lands, territories and resources which they have traditionally owned or otherwise occupied or used, and which have been confiscated, occupied, used or damaged without their free and informed consent. Where this is not possible, they have the right to just and fair compensation. Unless otherwise freely agreed upon by the peoples concerned, compensation shall take the form of lands, territories and resources equal in quality, size and legal status.

Article 28

Indigenous peoples have the right to the conservation, restoration and protection of the total environment and the productive capacity of their lands, territories and resources, as well as to assistance for this purpose from States and through international cooperation. Military activities shall not take place in the lands and territories of indigenous peoples, unless otherwise freely agreed upon by the peoples concerned.

States shall take effective measures to ensure that no storage or disposal of hazardous materials shall take place in the lands and territories of indigenous peoples.

States shall also take effective measures to ensure, as needed, that programmes for monitoring, maintaining and restoring the health of indigenous peoples, as developed and implemented by the peoples affected by such materials, are duly implemented.

Article 29

Indigenous peoples are entitled to the recognition of the full ownership, control and protection of their cultural and intellectual property.

They have the right to special measures to control, develop and protect their sciences, technologies and cultural manifestations, including human and other genetic resources, seeds, medicines, knowledge of the properties of fauna and flora, oral traditions, literatures, designs and visual and performing arts.

Article 30

Indigenous peoples have the right to determine and develop priorities and strategies for the development or use of their lands, territories and other resources, including the right to require that States obtain their free and informed consent prior to the approval of any project affecting their lands, territories and other resources, particularly in connection with the development, utilization or exploitation of mineral, water or other resources. Pursuant to agreement with the indigenous peoples concerned, just and fair compensation shall be provided for any such activities and measures taken to mitigate adverse environmental, economic, social, cultural or spiritual impact.

PART VII

Article 31

Indigenous peoples, as a specific form of exercising their right to self-determination, have the right to autonomy or self-government in matters relating to their internal and local affairs, including culture, religion, education, information, media, health, housing, employment, social welfare, economic activities, land and resources management, environment and entry by non-members, as well as ways and means for financing these autonomous functions.

Article 32

Indigenous peoples have the collective right to determine their own citizenship in accordance with their customs and traditions. Indigenous citizenship does not impair the right of indigenous individuals to obtain citizenship of the States in which they live.

Indigenous peoples have the right to determine the structures and to select the membership of their institutions in accordance with their own procedures.

Article 33

Indigenous peoples have the right to promote, develop and maintain their institutional structures and their distinctive juridical customs, traditions, procedures and practices, in accordance with internationally recognized human rights standards.

Article 34

Indigenous peoples have the collective right to determine the responsibilities of individuals to their communities.

Article 35

Indigenous peoples, in particular those divided by international borders, have the right to maintain and develop contacts, relations and cooperation, including activities for spiritual, cultural, political, economic and social purposes, with other peoples across borders.

States shall take effective measures to ensure the exercise and implementation of this right.

Article 36

Indigenous peoples have the right to the recognition, observance and enforcement of treaties, agreements and other constructive arrangements concluded with States or their successors, according to their original spirit and intent, and to have States honour and respect such treaties, agreements and other constructive arrangements. Conflicts and disputes which cannot otherwise be settled should be submitted to competent international bodies agreed to by all parties concerned.

PART VIII

Article 37

States shall take effective and appropriate measures, in consultation with the indigenous peoples concerned, to give full effect to the provisions of this Declaration. The rights recognized herein shall be adopted and included in national legislation in such a manner that indigenous peoples can avail themselves of such rights in practice.

Article 38

Indigenous peoples have the right to have access to adequate financial and technical assistance, from States and through international cooperation, to pursue freely their political, economic, social, cultural and spiritual development and for the enjoyment of the rights and freedoms recognized in this Declaration.

Article 39

Indigenous peoples have the right to have access to and prompt decision through mutually acceptable and fair procedures for the resolution of conflicts and disputes with States, as well as to effective remedies for all infringements of their individual and collective rights. Such a decision shall take into consideration the customs, traditions, rules and legal systems of the indigenous peoples concerned.

Article 40

The organs and specialized agencies of the United Nations system and other intergovernmental organizations shall contribute to the full realization of the provisions of this Declaration through the mobilization, inter alia, of financial cooperation and technical assistance. Ways and means of ensuring participation of indigenous peoples on issues affecting them shall be established.

Article 41

The United Nations shall take the necessary steps to ensure the implementation of this Declaration including the creation of a body at the highest level with special competence in this field and with the direct participation of indigenous peoples. All United Nations bodies shall promote respect for and full application of the provisions of this Declaration.

PART IX

Article 42

The rights recognized herein constitute the minimum standards for the survival, dignity and well-being of the indigenous peoples of the world.

Article 43

All the rights and freedoms recognized herein are equally guaranteed to male and female indigenous individuals.

Article 44

Nothing in this Declaration may be construed as diminishing or extinguishing existing or future rights indigenous peoples may have or acquire.

Article 45

Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act contrary to the Charter of the United Nations.

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real jack

a bit silly gdev

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Posts: 5489

08/05/08 11:16:15

itaukei have been stealing names from eachother anyway - i cavuti that should have been recorded in the NLC records in many places were covered over or deliberately stolen to hide the histories of many mataqali's - that thing happened even within itaukei society- and it happened during the veitarogi vanua itself where they swore oaths on the bible - that conning and stealing went on inside itaukei society itself.

so this thing about the Fijian name argument is a bit silly when you consider that the word "Fijian" is a British Colonial invention - and when you take it against the history of what itaukei have been doing to itaukei over generations within the VKB - there's no sense in arguing about the word "Fijian" when the VKB records in many places have stolen the i cavuti and names of many mataqali's.

anyway when Vijay Singh plays on the international golf circuit, everybody makes a point about him being Fijian - the media always underline that like its a badge of honour - and they underscore it even in TV reports with phrases like "Fijian Vijay Singh today won the US Masters......" as if we don't already know he is Fijian ! lol.

this argument about the word "Fijian" won't put bread and butter on the table - nor does it make a difference - that word is not our itaukei identity anyway - its a British word that came in with the Brits - in the past our ancestors had their own i cavuti, tokatoka, mataqali (batinilovo in the west), yavusa and vanua.

Last Edited By: real jack 08/05/08 11:27:35. Edited 1 time.

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gdevreal

Actually Fiji came from Fisi

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Posts: 497

08/05/08 12:06:56

a Tongan term referring to the islands to the west which started to become unified under missionary influence and when it stood up to Maafu.
Outside of Fiji, the word is used differently by people who do not know.
But in Fiji, as you well know, Fijian is refers to a particular ethnic group, not a citizenship. Its meaning as an ethnic identifier is lost if it used as a term of nationality. There is no need for this.
The people who persistently bring this up are the ones set on marginalizing the culture. There is no other reason for it. There are alternative names which can be used for a common national name. The UN has recognized ethic identity and diversity as important, even if you don't. Why not pick a neutral term? Why would Fiji Citizen bother anyone. It is purely factual and avoids the confusion over ethnicity.
No, it is not silly.
Can the Hindi language now be called "Fijian"?

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Kalougata

Gdev, your argument is far too late to make

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Posts: 285

08/05/08 12:43:35

Ratu

a difference now. There is a commercial on T.V. almost every weekend with Vijay Singh and some kids promoting St. Judes Hospital and they refer to Vijay as "The Big Fijian". Guess what, advertising and commercials are what gets into the homes and minds and what drives cultures around the world, not your "suspect interpretation" of some U.N. blather. Do you really think most people in the world pay attention to the U.N.?

Reply Quote

gdevreal

The UN IS the People of the World

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Posts: 498

08/06/08 01:48:48

Archaic perhaps, but they still discuss, debate, and vote on things.
As for the media, they can say whatever they want, and the foreign media is not known for cultural sensitivity. Aussies and Kiwis have been confused for years because they have in one case indigenous who are largely marginalized, and in the other indigenous who have their own name and don't need a colonial name like "New Zealand", "New South Wales", "New Guinea", etc.
What we are talking about here is the plight of indigenous people and the various ways in which colonials and diasporics marginalized them, knowingly or not. The UN has recognized this. In fact, India is one of the worst offenders. I have heard that on average a culture and indigenous language disappears every day there. This is what you get from a backward racist nation with money and guns.
Are you aware, too, that Fiji has a constitution?
People don't need to listen to a little runt like Samy holding forth about his Master's feces with an army of mercenary guns behind him and then Voreqe saying that the "Charter of the People" will be implemented whether the People want it or not. It will be interesting to see the propaganda and tricks he uses to try to pretend that his $4 million bribe Charter has the support of a majority of the People of Fiji. That would take an internationally supervised referendum or election by the existing constitutional rules. I have not heard much about HOW the Voice of the People is to be heard. Most likely the Charter will be taken around to a number of settlements known to be supportive or intimidated, and while the TV cameras roll, a wall of Green soldiers will be visible with their guns in the background, hidden from the cameras. In other words, it has already been decided that Chaudhry will win the election, the military for an emergency coup any time he starts to lose, the majority of the People will have nothing to say about it, and the few who control the guns will be paid off. No one will be fooled, but no one will do anything about it until later when they get fed up and then the assassinations, ambushes, accidental deaths, and deaths by mysterious causes will start. The tactics Chaudhry, Voreqe, and Kati Mara use merely set the stage for the next coup. The only stabilizing factor is the Constitution, but they seem inclined to ignore it, and I doubt Voreqe and Kati Mara have even read it. They don't need to read, they just take orders and act on impulse in a way that bolsters their self-image. They don't understand and don't care to understand things like social good and economic progress because these things are not subject to the command mentality and they don't need them to support their handful of goons with guns who keep the rest of the People subdued, poverty stricken, and unaware of the opportunities open to free human beings.

Last Edited By: gdevreal 08/06/08 11:42:22. Edited 2 times.

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Ranawai

Please Re-Read RealJack

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Posts: 1146

08/07/08 02:06:46

The part when he says that the word "Fijian" is a European invention. Seaman Bethold, a colonial writer chronicled the evolution of the word "Fijian". The European settlers of the ealy noneteenth century thought that indigenous Fijians were referring to the islands as viti, interpreted as Fiji or (Feejee) by Europeans who did not understand indigenous languages or culture.

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Alohabula1

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Posts: 922

08/07/08 03:41:21

Ratu

I am sure glad that the people of Hawaii didn't adopt the British name bestowed upon their islands, or they would be known as Sandwiches

Reply Quote

gdevreal

Seemann

#10

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Posts: 511

08/08/08 02:35:37

Berthold Seemann in Government Mission to the Fijian Islands (1862) notes that the Tasman gave the name "Prince William 's Island".
The inhabitants (no written language) called it Viti, the Tongans referred to it as Fisi, and the name which became accepted as the group evolved from a bunch of independed islands and matanitu, and documented by the missionaries in their writings was "Feejee" or "Fiji", the indigenous inhabitants were Fijians and the Bauan language documented by the missionaries was commonly know also as "Fijian".
While this is interesting, it is somewhat beside the point. Languages evolve. No matter what its beginnings were, the term Fijian continued refer to the indigenous inhabitants of Fiji, from the time other races started to reside in Fiji until today. Therefore the name belongs to these People.
To try to hijack it for some other meaning or purpose is theft from the People who own it. The Regime under Chaudhry and Samy has also tried to hijack and destroy every other support group in the Fijian culture. This includes the GCC, the Provincial Councils, FHL, the chiefly system, etc. These represent a threat to diasporics like Samy and Chaudhry because they give the indigenous people something that the immigrants to not have, and that is intolerable to them. Their idea is to destroy all cultural aspects of the indigenous people and them move in with their expertise in scamming, cheating, and lying to take over the economy and the nation. It us called "Let the better man win" and is justified in religion and culture by the Hindu caste system.
It is obvious why a diaspora would seek to do this, but it is an aggressive, negative reason, the purpose being to destroy something that your perceived competition has and you do not have.
For the John Samy's of the World there are ethnic identifiers, Fijian, Indian, Chinese, Part-European, etc. which have evolved over the years since foreigners started to arrive in Fiji.
Contitutionally the common name for all Fiji Citizens is "Fiji Islander". These can be used without offending anyone and in any case were agreed to by most folks, Indian and Fijian, when the 97 Constitution came in. Of course John Samy had run away by then and was busy spreading his ilk and seed in Manila. What John Samy is trying to do is implement a diaspora, and rob a People of a name that was given to them and they have accepted. The motives are obviously sinester. If John longs to be Fijian, why did he give up his work in Fiji and his citizenship. For the almighty $? Whatever, he has no claim whatsoever to the name "Fijian" now in any sense of the word and what is his business suggesting that the name should be taken from the Fijians? Perhaps if he divorces his wives and marries a Fijian he can become known as a "Vasu", but who would have the runt?

Last Edited By: gdevreal 08/08/08 02:58:27. Edited 1 time.

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Ranawai

Common Name

#11

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Posts: 1147

08/13/08 02:47:52

I had running debates in the 1990s with Francis Sokonibogi of (Kudru ni Vanua). In the end, there was agreement that Fijian as a common name was good for the country. Submissions to that effect was made to the Constitution Review Commission (CRC), but at the time, there was resistance in rural Fiji against Fijian being used as a common name. So the compromise was Fiji Islanders. However following the prmulgation of the 1997 Constitution, none of the governments including LQs attempted to remove the communal Fijian/Indian distinctions from immigration forms, passport applications, birthcertificate etc. As a result, the Fijian/Indian distinction continued.

For LQ to support Fiji Islander is a joke. Not to mention the Methodist Church which supported the fusion of church and state, indigenous nationalism and nationalist coups.

All I can say is that the military council will never support any ethnonationalists.

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xtali1

CAn't make up your mind Ranawai......whether you support the IG...or

#12

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Posts: 1101

08/13/08 02:56:20

Ratu

...the SDL or what? But just like the sheep to the slaughter and people like Jim Ah Koy, Beddoes et al, just go with the flow, change directions with the wind and see where the waves take you, eh?

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Nosapo

#13

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Posts: 539

08/07/08 16:13:26

Ratu

Alohabula1,

And perhaps the Hawaiians would then have an Earl of S.W.

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Alohabula1

#14

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Posts: 924

08/07/08 16:36:47

Ratu

These British have a funny way of coming up with names....you are right the British Earl use to like to play cards for days so rather than stop for a meal he would slap some meat between two pieces of bread...hence the Sandwich.....but taking that concept and trying to make it a name for an island nation is pretty classic. I doubt we will never know the true spelling of Hawaii, which they spelt Owhyhee and decided to drop the y right out of the 13 letter alphabet that was bestowed upon the language. It gets even more bizarre because words started to be Hawaiianized like Beretania street is actually Britain street, that okay except that there is no B's or R's or T's in the Hawaiian alphabet so how can that be a Hawaiinization? I guess they decided.... Ahhhh we'll just make it up as we go along, heck they didn't even have a written language before we came so the sky is the limit when it comes to rules of language. THey must have really liked the Fijians and Maori's because they gave them all kinds of letters haha.

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